Dougie’s MASSIVE Monday Mail Bag By Doug Fischer (May 5, 2008) Photo © German Villasenor Send this page to friend Give us your feedback Read on for fan feedback – pro and con – on Oscar De La Hoya’s dominant decision victory over Steve Forbes in this week’s MMMB. Enjoy! OSCAR DE LA HO-HUM Hey Doug, Well the fight went pretty much as I expected and I had to fight to stay awake after a few rounds. So Oscar won... good for him, but I still won't be shelling out $60 to see him fight Mayweather (as much as I would like to see him or SOMEBODY, jack Floyd's jaw). Oscar tried to make it a fight the first time but Floyd would have no part of it and it was deadly dull. I can't see it being any different this time....and who is Oscar's proposed third opponent for the year? Surely not the winner of Cotto/Margarito (unless Oscar wants HIS jaw jacked)! FINALLY... (and I hate to harp on this) but one of the PUSSYCAT DOLLS to sing the national anthem!? Was that the come F#*k me version of that tune? (yeah I know how Hendrix played it at Woodstock but that was in front of a half a million stoned hippies in 1969 not an internationally broadcast event, and besides, Jimi was WAY cooler than the bimbos in the Pussycat Dolls). End of rant.......thanks. – David (Nashville) Watching from TV, I thought De La Hoya looked sharp Saturday night, sharp enough to beat Steve Forbes and other solid but undersized veterans like Ricky Hatton and Zab Judah, or even lover-level 154-pound and middleweight contenders like John Duddy and Verno Phillips, but I don’t see him out-boxing Floyd Mayweather if/when they duke it out for a second time in September. De La Hoya has hinted that his third bout this year could be against Miguel Cotto. I’m certainly not going to hold my breath for that one. In a perfect world, De La Hoya would have announced at the start of this year that he would face the winner of a Floyd Mayweather-Miguel Cotto showdown this September or December. Who knows? Had he done that perhaps his considerable clout and star power could have created TWO legit superbouts this year. I’ve watched Saturday’s HBO broadcast twice, so far, once with a group of friends and once at home alone, and neither time did I pay any attention to the singing of the national anthem. I decided to check out Steve Kim’s live blog from the Home Depot Center’s press row (which was really funny) when I was with my pals and I did the dishes when I was at home. I didn’t sit down and face the tube until the bell rang for the first round, so I really can’t comment on the “pussycat doll” (although Kim mentioned in his blog that "she is gorgeous. She could've belted out the Star Spangled like Roseanne Barr and I don’t think anyone would care..."). OSCAR DE LA HOPE Well lo and behold, Oscar looked pretty good, and was able to keep his activity up the whole fight. Maybe this was his opponent, but maybe he actually DID learn to relax in there. Whatever it was, I enjoyed the fight. Is it too much to hope De la Hoya can perform at that level against Money? I know Mayweather isn't Forbes, but damn it for Oscar getting my hopes up!!! Oh well, I will anxiously await Shane's win over Judah at the end of the month, either mid to late round stoppage (crosses fingers) or unanimous decision (likely). Take care, Doug. – Patrick I like Mosley by decision in a tough fight. I also thought De La Hoya looked good against Forbes. I liked his activity and the fact that everything in his offensive arsenal came off of his jab. His footwork looked the best it has since the rematch with Shane Mosley, in my opinion. But I couldn’t tell if he was relaxing in there because he wasn’t getting enough heat (either from pressure or punching power) from Forbes to stress him out. It’s not too much to hope that De La Hoya performs at the same level he did vs. Forbes in his proposed rematch with Mayweather. It is, however, probably too much to hope that it will be enough to out-box or out-class Mayweather. I think De La Hoya performs better when he’s in the role of an active boxer (as he was Saturday night) than when he tries to be a pressure fighter (which failed at last May against Mayweather), but the dilemma for Oscar is that Floyd is a versatile ring general who can adapt to different styles. At the end of the day, his in-the-ring IQ is higher than De La Hoya’s. OSCAR DE GET-HIT-A LOT Doug, I'm no expert, but the amount of times Oscar got hit has me concerned that what we saw was really more of a mirage than anything else. Sure he looked great, but he got hit too much, to me. Not that I think Forbes is bad. It's hard to tell for sure, b/c Forbes has no pop and Oscar has always had a really good chin to me. But I was not overly impressed with his performance. Having said that, I actually felt he beat Floyd last year, and if Oscar can repeat his activity from the first half of that bout thru out the whole fight, I feel he can win a boring, close, split decision this time around. Thoughts? Take care. – Louie I’m a little confused by your comments. On one hand, you think Oscar’s performance Saturday night was a mirage, but on the other hand you thought he beat Mayweather the first time and can legitimately win the second time (albeit in boring fashion). I don’t think De La Hoya’s sharpness and points dominance was a mirage. Even at age 35, when he trains his ass off and faces a solid but non-elite fighter, he can handily beat them. He got hit a lot for three reasons: one, he’s never been a defensive wizard; two, he was very active against Forbes and Stevie is a good counter-puncher; and three, he made a mistake by trying to nail Forbes with right hands all night; Stevie is very good and slipping rights and countering. I thought Mayweather easily won eight rounds vs. De La Hoya last year. OSCAR OK, VAZQUEZ-MARQUEZ THE BEST Dougie, DLH looked okay against Steve Forbes, but Mayweather is another matter . . . although I have some respect for Forbes for being the physically (and significantly smaller guy) and taking those punches and firing back - even if it was ineffective . . . I also saw the Vasquez-Marquez trilogy on Showtime . . . and I didn't see the third fight until tonight . . . and WOW! . .. that was the best trilogy I ever saw -- even better than Gatti-Ward, Bowe-Holyfield, etc. . . . call me crazy - but I thought Marquez won that last fight by two points . . . still, it didn't matter - that was awesome . . . there was more action in one round of those fights than the whole DLH-Forbes fight . . . you really can't praise these two warriors enough . . . – danC There was more action in any of the 25 rounds of the Vazquez-Marquez trilogy than in the last five entire bouts of Oscar De La Hoya and Floyd Mayweather COMBINED! Vazquez-Marquez was the best three-fight series I ever witnessed or covered, and I was ringside for all three Barrera-Morales bouts. I had Vazquez winning the rubbermatch by one point (114-113), and I scored the final round 10-7 for the purest warrior in the sport, so I wouldn’t call you crazy for having Marquez win by a couple of points. THE HOMECOMING Mr. Fischer, Good evening, I hope all is well. A couple quick hits: 1. It was a good fight Saturday night, although it would have been nice to see an undercard. At least give us one undercard fight. I am glad Forbes was able to finish the fight on his feet and without a knockdown. 2. HBO should have interviewed Forbes after the fight. Let us hear what he has to say. That's just rude. 3. I consider myself a hardcore fan, but I know I am in the minority about Oscar v. Mayweather II. Oscar is my favorite fighter and I wanna see him beat Floyd. If Oscar can't stop Forbes, I doubt he'll stop Mayweather. He better hit the treadmill hard. 4. RIP Chico, you are not forgotten. Keep up the good work. – Jaime, San Francisco 1)I would have liked to see another bout on the HBO broadcast, but to be honest, none of De La Hoya-Forbes undercard bouts were “co-feature” worthy of an ESPN or Telefutura main event. 2)I agree. I wanted to hear what Forbes, who has always been an articulate and thoughtful interview, had to say after the fight. 3)If you’re a De La Hoya fan and you want to see him try to beat Mayweather in the rematch, there’s nothing wrong with that. The bottom line for fans who don’t want to see the rematch is that they don’t have to buy the live pay-per-view broadcast or watch the replay. 4)Wow, you just reminded me that this Wednesday will be the one-year anniversary of Diego Corrales’ death. I’m not ashamed to admit that I forgot that Chico passed away last May. I prefer to remember him in life, particularly the thrills he produced in the prize ring. DIRELL & DEMARCO I would say that Andre Dirrell has arrived in the super middleweight division. It's really amazing the difference between this and his last fight. I don't know whether its a case of styles making for different fights or maybe he figured out that without a little excitement theres no paycheck down the road. At any rate, he looked pretty formidable against a game challenger. I think if Allan Green's colon has healed up yet he would be a good matchup for Dirrell, or maybe a tough guy like Andrade to really give him a gut check and a step up into the real contenders. Tony Demarco also made a good showing of himself. He is fun to watch, maybe not the best defensive technician, though. At first I was thinking he was a top 10 challenger in the lightweight division, then I really though about it, man, that division is FULL of talent, but he is at the least a fun to watch prospect. See ya. – jbird If Dirrell continues to box the way he did Friday night, I’ll quickly forget about the “Andre Gazelle” nickname I gave him after the track meet he put vs. Curtis Stephens. He showed guts, composure and fantastic hand speed vs. Tony Hanshaw. However, he also got tagged by more than a few slow right hands from the Ohioan. I don’t think Dre is ready for the likes of Green or Andrade just yet. I’d put him in with a few “Contenders” like Jesse Brinkley and Peter Manfredo Jr. or a legit fringe contender like the winner of next month’s Jean Pascal-Fulgencio Zuniga bout before I put the super-speedster in with experienced young vets like Green (who’s got quick mitts of his own, plus good power in his hook) or Andrade (who can take anything anyone can dish out and press hard all night long). If Dirrell is moved too fast he might remind us of the moniker I gave him after he was dropped by journeyman Alfonso Rocha two years ago in Southern California, “Andre Drilled”. DeMarco is always a joy to watch. The guy has natural tools (height, reach, lefty stance, speed and pop) plus skills, but he loves to scrap! God Bless him! I’d love to see DeMarco test young undefeated contenders (who in actuality might still be prospects) like Amir Khan and Anthony Peterson. ENJOYED THE FIGHT, NOT HTE COMMENTARY Hey Dougie: I was yelling at the TV last night and told my girl that the first thing I would do Sunday morning is write you. About Larry Merchant: although I love him and am happy HBO kept him on, he repeatedly pisses me off with his fight commentary. It was obvious to anyone last night that Stevie Forbes was outmatched in terms of size and power. The man was trying his hardest to land punches but was just not big enough to win. Even my girl mentioned that if he had a longer reach the fight would have been different. Larry continuously commented about how Forbes should abandon defense at the risk of getting KO'd. It's so easy to say that when you're a journalist who likely never got in the ring with another man. Larry doesn't like the essence of boxing. The idea is hit and not get hit and not everyone SHOULD be Arturo Gatti. I'm not saying that a fighter should run a la Dirrell, but Forbes was willing to engage and did land some leather - Oscar wasn't showing bruises b/c he was taking a walk in the park. Anyway, I just had to vent about that. As for the fight, I thought Oscar did look very sharp and more relaxed than usual. He somewhat resembled the Oscar that fought MA Gonzalez. His jab was sharp and his conditioning was excellent. Let's see if he can do that in a more intense atmosphere. However, I don't want to see him against Mayweather again (who does?). I would much rather see him bypass that sideshow to see him fight Miguel Cotto. With his improved boxing skills, Cotto would force exchanges and the fight would be interesting until DLH either slows down from that body attack or turns the clock back. DLH would still enjoy a reach and height advantage, and the fight would give him the opportunity to make up for his last mega-fight against a PR star, not to mention do serious PPV business. How do you see that fight playing out? Keep up the great work with TNR - if I were HBO, I would hire you and Steve in a heartbeat to replace Jim & Larry in a few years once they decide to move on. Maybe your boy Nate Campbell can join you to add the fighter's perspective. Speaking of which, I'm glad you got Nate to write - his opinions are well thought out and informative. The man more than deserves the chance to fight the best lightweights. How about an Amir Khan-Anthony Peterson eliminator on the undercard of Campbell-Casamayor? Those guys need to beat a top contender before getting their shot - enough of this free title shot sh*t. Take it easy. – Manny Blanco Oh yeah, that’s just what the bigwigs at HBO would want during a boxing broadcast, me and the K-Hammer crapping on their contract fighters like Wlad Klitschko and Money May and pooh-poohing potential financial blockbusters like De La Hoya-Mayweather I and II. And could you imagine me, Steve and Nate Campbell calling the action to a Joel Casamayor fight? I’m cracking up just thinking about it. I’d love to see Khan and Peterson (the number one and two 135-pound contenders in the WBO’s rankings) fight for the right to face either Casamayor or Campbell. I think De La Hoya-Cotto would be a big event and an entertaining fight (more so than De La Hoya-Mayweather), but to be honest, I’m not that interested in seeing that showdown because beating the Golden Boy at this stage of his career really doesn’t mean that much and far better action fights (Margarito) and significant matchups (Mayweather) exist for the Puerto Rican star. As for Merchant’s commentary, I enjoyed it for the most part even though I agree that he was a bit hard on Forbes at times. The thing about Merchant that you have to understand is that he’s in his 70s. He came of age during boxing’s Golden Age when hardnosed SOB’s like Ray Robinson, Jake LaMotta, Carmen Basilio, Kid Gavilan, Rocky Marciano and Ezzard Charles were filling arenas and on TV. As a sports columnist for the Philadelphia Daily News and the New York Post he covered the careers of great fighters like Muhammad Ali and Joe Frazier. As a result, my guess is that his expectations for action at the supposedly highest levels of the sport are pretty high, and he’s going to expect gritty do-or-die efforts from even the most athletically gifted boxers in the game. DE LA HOYA NOT SO DUMB Hi Dougie, DLH Not As Dumb As He Sounds...... Could you imagine what Oscar's face would have looked like had he fought Cotto, Margarito, Judah or even Cintron for that matter last night..? He clearly chose Forbes not so much because he mirrors Floyd's style as much as the fact that he was so much smaller and feather fisted. I think Stevie had some trouble with the bigger man, but I gotta tell you he fought valiantly and made it interesting for a few rounds. He earned his pay last night. I had the fight 8-3 and 1 round even for Oscar. Unless P__SY Floyd shows up rusty as hell, he is going to beat the s__t out of Oscar in September. Millie better keep Oscar at home and not feed him to Cotto. Otherwise we are going to see a disfigured DLH beaten and battered for rounds. – Angel Watching from TV, I thought De La Hoya easily won 10 or 11 rounds. However, I thought at least six of those rounds De La Hoya won were close and competitive. Forbes, like you noted, was able to tag De La Hoya. And even though he’s not a power puncher, he was able to redden Goldie’s face and produce a few nicks around the millionaire’s nose. There’s no doubt that a true welterweight puncher could have busted De La Hoya up. I think body snatchers like Cotto and Margarito would be even harder on Goldie than harder punching head hunters like Judah and Cintron. PAY-PER-VIEW PROJECTION How many ppv buys do you think de la hoya vs mayweather 2 will get? Let the soap opera begin!!! – George I think the rematch will do seven figures. I’m not sure if it will exceed 2 million, but I’m almost positive that it tops 1 million. BORING! Well that was a BORING fight... at least from my point of view... Oscar dominated just about every aspect of the fight.. He looked good, he was bigger, stronger and pretty quick for an "old guy"... I thought the first fight between Oscar and Floyd was a waste of my money.. For the price the fight never lived up to the hype and I can't envision myself paying $50 - 60 - 70 to watch a rematch......... But Oscar has a ton of fans who will pay to see it...... Heck I am SHOCKED this fight wasn't pay per view...... Oscar has always loved to take advantage of his fan base with crazy pay per view fights... I think the only thing I can't stand in boxing is Oscar claiming to be a former "Middleweight" champion..... I am just ranting now but with all these belts the sport is so diluted.... First off he was handed a gift vs Strum and Second Strum was nothing more than a top contender with a token belt.... He never has truly been a Middleweight Champion... Just like Roy Jones Jr. has never been a Heavyweight Champion.... Yeah he beat a top 10 heavyweight but there is no way Roy could hang with the Monsters at Heavyweight...... But for ever people will say Oscar was a Middleweight Champion and Roy was a Heavyweight champion.... Keep up the good work. – Robert, Memphis, TN An argument could be made that Jones was never a real middleweight “champ”. That 160-pound belt he won by out-pointing Bernard Hopkins was vacated by the “real” champ James Toney, who Jones schooled at 168 pounds (where I considered RJ to be a “real” champ). De La Hoya’s world titles at 130 pounds and 160 pounds were B.S. I give him credit for the titles he won at 135, 140, 147 and 154 pounds and I considered him to be the “real” champ at lightweight, welterweight and junior middleweight. I’m not putting down Jones or De La Hoya. Many multi-division champs of the ‘80s, ‘90s and this decade won bogus world titles. The 168-pound title that Tommy Hearns won from James Kinchen held little significance. The 168 and 175-pound belts that Ray Leonard won in a single fight (vs. Donny LaLonde) were meaningless. The 140-pound title Floyd Mayweather won from Arturo Gatti and the 147-pound strap he took from Zab Judah were crap. SO WHAT? Hi Dougie, So, De la hoya beat a little fella over 12 rounds, did we learn anything by it....well, while Oscar was able to parry many of the shorter armed Forbes punches, it did appear to me that Oscar's reactions are clearly slowing i.e. he looked real static and motionless on the few occasions that he had to go on the defensive. I dont doubt Oscars self belief and commitment, but do you think his handlers really believe he can improve upon and actually beat Mayweather when the time finally arrives? Oscar suggests that taking a year off has done him good, that he's somehow better for it! At 35, at this level and weight division, how exactly does that work? Not being a huge fan of either, but out of the two, I thought Mayweather looked the puncher last time out....the only true intrigue for me is whether or not Mayweather stops him. Personally, I hope the fight doesn't come off....I remember Sugar Ray taking a beating from Terry Norris, and then Hector Camacho....who are the individuals that encourage these guys to continue boxing at a time when they should be moving on with their lives, shame on them. Regards. – Reg Coates (U.K) Usually, the “individuals” who encourage fighters to continue boxing when they are clearly past their primes are the fellas who stare them in the face every time they look in a mirror. I also thought Mayweather was the harder puncher vs. De La Hoya. A lot of that had to do with the accuracy of his shots. I don’t think inactivity ever serves a fighter, particularly boxers who rely on speed and reflexes like De La Hoya, but perhaps at his age and with his history of injuries (to his left hand, wrist and shoulder) he meant that taking a year off was good for his body to heal up. LOOKIN' GOOD FOR AN OLD MAN Oscar looked good for a semi retired fighter in his mid 30s. For a fighter looking to fight a top 5 welterweight, not so much. He looked slower than he has, and he got marked up remarkably easy. This rematch is going to be a bona fide joke. – Dave I wouldn’t call it a joke. A joke fight is Cotto vs. Gomez, a bout in which you know the underdog not only has ZERO chance of winning but you can also count on him catching an embarrassing beatdown without the favorite breaking a sweat. Some past “jokes” that come to mind are Roy Jones vs. Ricky Frazier and Glen Kelly; Riddick Bowe vs. Michael Dokes and Jesse Ferguson; and Michael Nunn vs. Dan Morgan. Oscar is still good enough to be competitive with Mayweather, it’s just that their styles mesh in a manner that makes for an uneventful fight and it’s very unlikely that Goldie will be able to improve on his performance from one year ago. OVERRATED OSCAR Hey Dougie, I'm getting tired of HBO riding Oscar's jock already. Oscar beat a blown up lightweight who was a 17-1 underdog and HBO made it seem like a rejuvinated Oscar looked sharp and relaxed and turned in a great performance. The reason Oscar didn't fade and seemed more relaxed throughout this fight is because he didn't have to work that hard while walking down the much smaller man nor did he have to worry about getting caught with anything. Forbes is such a great guy, but he clearly does not belong anywhere above 140 as journeyman Grady Brewer proved. Even then, I thought Forbes had his moments in the fight, but he was just too small to be effective or set up a consistent offence. The notion that this performance validated a Mayweather rematch is bulls__t. I think Joshua Clottey would've beaten Oscar on Saturday. Oscar's had a great career, but I don't believe he's an ATG at all. Yes, he's fought many big name fighters, but he always seemed to have some sort of edge against them. (Chavez, Whitaker, and Mayweather were all smaller, Quartey was coming of a 16 month layoff, Vargas was on the decline after the Trinidad beating, etc.) Trinidad was the riskiest matchup he stunk out the show by running the last four rounds. Lots of fighters would have faced as many big names if they were given the opportunity. Oscar just had the advantage of using his fame to get him any fight he wished; but that doesn't change the fact that he lost all the big ones. He unsuccessfully tried to avenge the Mosley loss, but he refused to grant rematches to Quartey and Whitaker, who both arguably beat DLH. Mayweather should fight the winner of the Cotto-Margarito fight or even Shane Mosley assuming he'll get by Judah but of course he won't. That's why I'm not a Mayweather fan anymore and I think Pernell Whitaker and Bernard Hopkins were both better than Floyd. – Will Whitaker and Hopkins were indeed better than Mayweather, which is why you have to give De La Hoya more props than you seem willing to do. Yes, you can ARGUE that Oscar lost to Sweet Pea 11 years ago, but you could also argue that he deserved the decision (although not by the margins the official judges awarded him). Whitaker is an all-time great, IMO. And yeah, he got owned and taken out by B-Hop, but he still got in there with the old dirty bastard, who I also consider great. And yeah, De La Hoya did stink the joint out in the final three rounds of his fight with Tito, but as you are fond of saying, one could ARGUE that Goldie won that fight. So, while I agree that Oscar’s not an ATG, by no means do I consider him to be overrated. This line cracked me up: “I'm getting tired of HBO riding Oscar's jock already”. Wow, it only took you 12 YEARS to get fed up! You’re more patient than I am. LOL. FIGHT COTTO-MARGARITO WINNER, OSCAR Hey Dougie, As always, love the mailbag and have really enjoyed it this year with all the great matchups. So, now that De La Hoya has beaten Forbes his next step is supposed to be Mayweather. However, for the good of the sport should it not be the Cotto-Margarito winner? If De La Hoya beats the winner this would actually MAKE me interested in seeing him take on Mayweather again. But, if the Cotto-Margarito winner beats De La Hoya, this could make the public (and financial) demand for Mayweather to take on the winner too high for even Mayweather to pass up. Or, is this all just a pipe dream and the dollar signs will win over the good of the sport? Anyway, would be awesome to see your take on how the rest of the year should unfold for De La Hoya. Oh yeah, all this being said: I am not alone in thinking that a prime Hearns would have dispatched of Mayweather within 7 rounds, right? Take care. – Andy, Chi-town “Is this all just a pipe dream and the dollar signs will win over the good of the sport?” “A prime Hearns would have dispatched of Mayweather within 7 rounds, right?” Come on man, you KNOW the answers to both of these questions, do I really need to spell it out for you? LOL! Yeah, it would be great if Oscar or Floyd would take on the winner of Cotto-Margarito but both multi-division titlists would rather take home $20 million-plus “boxing” each other than absorb brutal physical punishment against a relentless body snatcher. (Plus, I have a feeling that both former Top Rank fighters would rather not benefit their old boss by taking on one of his two toughest welterweights.) We can’t fault them for that, but we don’t have to pay attention to the September rematch. We can instead give Cotto and Margarito the credit they deserve for facing each other (if that fight does indeed get made) and we can support them by purchasing the pay-per-view show or by buying a ticket to the live event . Discuss this Topic - Go to the forums For Questions or Comments E-Mail Doug Fischer at dougie@maxboxing.com